The Doreen Virtue Christian Conversion Conversation

Just to let you know, I started this in April 2017 when Doreen Virtue was newly born again and had said negative things about the Ascended Masters books and decks. I see that The Doreen Virtue/Jesus conversation has flared again, making me want to continue working on this piece to share my take on it…

So, I’ve been coming across some really interesting information and debate in the New Age Spiritual Community concerning Hay House author and angel guru, Doreen Virtue.

In the past few years, as many of you know, Doreen Virtue’s work and she, herself – as a brand and celebrity – have skyrocketed. She kind of cornered the angel market and held the reputation of the Queen of Angel Work for the past 10 years or so.

Personally, I have read some of her books and I own a few of her decks. I even volunteered for her in Salzburg, Austria and in Zurich, Switzerland. I met many beautiful friends and business colleagues through her work and at those events. I’ve found her teaching style to be very easy to follow and, I think, well set up for people who are just starting to work intensively with their intuition and with different entities.

Angel work, too, struck a chord with me. I’ve written about my experiences before and find the energy of the angels – or whatever you want to call them – soothing, calming, and just plain nice. When I call on the angels, I feel protected. When I ask the angels for signs they are with me, I often get something totally funny and totally distinct and totally meaningful to me – something that makes me laugh or feel just a little less alone in the Universe.

Some might argue that angels are portrayed as fearsome beings in the Bible, so I am not sure if what I am working with is truly angelic, but whatever – the energy is, to me, calming and healing. (ha-ha! I might get some kickback for this statement.)

I know that I often felt like an outsider in the angelic community, though – or kind of like a double agent of sorts. You see, many people who follow Doreen prefer to keep things on the lighter side. She recommends being vegan, shunning hair color and chemicals, and doing everything one can to remain in a “high vibration state”; I’ve been working on integrating my spiritual side with my earthly side. I curse and sometimes eat meat. I’m not always the most gentle soul in the room.

I am finding power in anger and expression and being REAL – not just (feeling like, to me) shining beams of rainbow glittery light on people who were pissing me off. When I work with sensitive people, I find more success in gently encouraging people to be more powerful and making some hard decisions, not just focusing on the positive in life, glossing over the uncomfortable things in life and especially in the people around them.

So, I’d been feeling that there was something lacking for me in Doreen Virtue’s teachings (like spiritual bypassing that many have been talking about lately) and I backed away from Doreen Virtue, her work, and her teachings. I had gotten what I needed from her message, and I decided to happily pursue my own path – one that diverged from the one that Doreen Virtue spoke about and embraced.

To me, spirituality is a distinctly personal journey. We all come across teachers and gurus who influence our spiritual path. Some of my own have included Wayne Dwyer, Tool (the band), Robert Anton Wilson, Caroline Myss, Gena Thomashauer, my mom and friends, TV and pop culture, art, Terence McKenna, acid experiences, and the Beatles. No one is right, no one is wrong. Everyone is doing their own thing at their own level, and that’s OK.

I know that I might come across a book, CD, or video that will help me to go to the next level, and I don’t cling to the creator of that work for long-term spiritual guidance. I allow my spirituality to evolve and flow in a natural way – and I know that others evolve and grow and shift as well.

So, back to Doreen Virtue and her recent spiritual evolution that included a baptism and turn toward Jesus-centered Christianity, to which I say, “Even though it isn’t for me, more power to her if it makes her feel more spiritually connected and true to her beliefs.” Doreen has always said she is aligned with Christian beliefs and has referenced those many times in the past. If she is born again, then good for her if it takes her to the next level.

The problem that many people have had with this in relation to a message that she sent out (in both video and audio format) that was quickly removed from the internet…. Basically put, from what I understand, she said that some of her followers had “demonic, dark” energy around them as did some of her former work, including the Archangels and Ascended Masters book and the Ascended Masters deck. She actually advised people to burn their copies of these books and the decks associated with them.

I wish I could find links to what she specifically said (from what I understand, moderators for her pages have been busy scrubbing any mention away), but I know that it had a really profound impact on many of the people in the community that she, herself, had built – many people who felt like outsiders in general society had found a comfortable home within the angel community.

For many of those people – especially those who didn’t necessarily vibe with the Jesus angle – it felt like a mixture of being betrayed by their leader and also being singled out as evil and bad, which stung some of those people to the core.

Aside from that, Doreen’s audience IS (or was) multi- cultural and denouncing gods and goddesses from different faiths or backgrounds kind of burned. Learning about different deities and their characteristics felt like bringing people of all faiths together. Declaiming them seems divisive and totally anti-what-I-thought-her-message-was-about.

And there was some sort of denouncing tarot readings and mediumship, too. Hm. Personally, my love for tarot started long before I ever heard Doreen’s name, volunteered for her, and my CACR™ certification is just one small piece of my tarot background and education. When people talk about their certifications being worthless, they might be purposefully overlooking the experience of the class and the content there – which likely added to their tarot practice.

There are those in the tarot community who love her and those who despise her. And really, as I mentioned before – her path is her own biz.

Apropos biz: Many people think her rebirth to the Christian faith is just a business decision – a way to pander products to a different part of the market. If it is, so be it. I almost laugh when I think about someone “selling out to Christ” – even though I know it is a thing. And I know that born-again Christians are popular now and they do have money to spend. But, as I said before, whatever. This is her thing and she can teach those who are interested in hearing what she has to say.

To sum up my feelings about Doreen Virtue’s Christian Conversion, the only thing that bothers me about it is the fact that she made people who she might have once built up feel bad. While her spirituality is, was, and will be her business, she probably should have given a LOT more thought to her words and message during her transition. She could have found different things to say than words like “denounce”, evil, false gods, etc., and not encouraged her team to scrub conversations or people to burn decks and books. A little bit more gentle and light would have been more appropriate.

That’s just my opinion, though.

Each of us has a different and unique spiritual path to follow – even those who are celebrities or gurus. Doreen Virtue embraced her Christian background and made some very public statements about some of what she used to teach. Ultimately, she has every right to follow her own path, but she could have parted ways with those who didn’t fit with her new beliefs in a more constructive manner.

What do you think? How do you feel about Doreen Virtue’s statements and how she handled the change?

35 Comments

  1. I feel like you, I liked many things she taught, but I don’t feel aligned with her Christian message she has been giving out lately – although I had not heard about this happening!! Very strange. Glad I read this!

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    • Thank you, Rachel. I feel like strange is a good word for how this unfolded. Ultimately, we can learn from many people – and we don’t have to keep working with/listening to someone when their message doesn’t fit our reality anymore.

      Have a fabulous day!!

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      • I agree. We can learn from many other people out there. I don’t agree with her newfound message and will not be following her or purchasing anymore of her products or literature.

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    • I am sad that she has stopped with the tarot card readings the way she did them. I went through a very difficult time in the past and knowing and receiving support confirming that there were angel signs was very good for me. I have also used her meditations and learned how to think more positive. I felt her weekly if not daily support! I’m missing her. But I will move forward and continue the meditations. Sometimes life is hard and there is such negative energy her angel therapy helped. Perhaps I regarded it as more therapeutic. It was nice I felt supported by her.

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      • Hi Tina,

        There are many, many tarot and angel card (and Certified Angel Card Readers) out there – myself included – who might be able to help you with a reading and with connecting to your angels. You can always find support from her community and also people like Kyle Gray and Radleigh Valentine.

        Blessings,
        Sue

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    • I have felt a lot of dark energy trying to pull individuals from the light. I discounted it and thought it was me. My angels are pure divine fun and loving. They tell me that they need us on earth to keep the love flowing. They mean it too. Doreen virtue has for a year been subtle moving from angel work and I feel anyone getting sucked into a church setting under a name of Jesus centred is false. I know from personal experience. The truth lies in your own set of beliefs.it is right that you don’t worship angels, angel alters etc are a form of idolatry. However, I always found a subtle falseness about her work and that’s my judgement. I feel at this time we have to battle against fear based energies others, the world and our own. Angels are here whether you believe or not. I feel tarot card reading should be done in love. If you do it lovingly and for the light there is nothing wrong in that. Jesus lives in you if you accept him into your life this is true. I witness to this. It’s what you do with love in your life. This is the catch. You don’t worship angels but you do need them for support and help against dark forces to protect and honour love which is you.

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      • Great points. Personally, I’ve also found working with angels to be a happy experience.

        It is interesting to see how this evolves.

        Kind regards,
        Sue

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      • BINGO! I totally agree. People will be falling back to sleep at this time. This is just all the more reason for us to move where our journey takes us.

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      • I agree with you. I will pray for her

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      • Joining in late on the conversation, but I feel you hit the nail on the head. I love my DV book on Ascended Masters and carry it with me everywhere. I have received no indication that anything on my path has changed and will continue to look to this book for guidance from all divinities: gods, goddesses and backgrounds. That is my path and I’m going to stick to it!

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        • YES!!! That is the thing. Each of us has a journey, no matter who our teacher was for a time.

          Thank you for your comment!

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    • I found that her teachings about angels made me feel not alone and supported. The fact that she is selling her animal ranch is like the final straw to her abandoning her followers.

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      • Yeah! I found that to be really odd. You’d think that someone with her amassed wealth wouldn’t have to sacrifice what seemed to be so important to her…

        And I agree with the “not feeling alone” from the angelic teachings. It had the same effect on me.

        Thanks for commenting, Tina!

        Kind regards,
        Sue

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  2. Hi Sue, Doreen didn’t denounce Tarot back in April, only the Ascended Masters. And she never used the word ‘denounce’ then or in the infamous Maui TV interview. The thing is, you don’t have to use the word denounce to denounce something. Do watch the video for yourself (https://youtu.be/0e8QYAWgJMo) and you’ll see what I mean. She denounces Tarot, mediumship and any form of predictive reading in this video. She also claims that the reason she hasn’t pulled all the works she no longer believe in is that she feels responsible for Hay House employees, which is funny considering how she claims to only serve God and not Mammon now – surely God would look after those employees too! I think it is very important to separate out the spiritual side of things, which you covered here (yes, it’s her biz) from the actual BIZ side of things where so many have paid hundreds if not thousands of dollars to get certified by her and now find it difficult to do what they planned which is to build a business around those certifications. Kinda difficult now for those who feel their teacher has lost credibility. This obivously makes the certificates feel worth LESS if not entirely worthless. To me they do feel worthless. I could have learned the same subjects just more in-depth without having to pay out of my ass. I did ask Hay House for a refund for the AI course… They declined, first citing Doreen Virtue’s blatant lie (see her latest newsletter or her own FB page) that she has never denounced any of her teachings. I sent the video link to them, letting them know that I felt it was even more embarrassing to be certified by her now that she is a public liar. They then said that it was too late because any refunds had to be made within 60 days of the purchase. HH is a highly immoral organisation, as is DV a highly immoral individual. Do you think it is a coincident that she issued these statements AFTER the 60 days were up for most of the people for this course which they pushed hard back in the spring? Of course not. I let HH know how I feel about it and I hope many others do too. Apropos everything that has happened, I wrote the following on my FB page this morning:

    If you, for any reason, are not happy with a service, course or product you have purchased from a business or organisation, you have certain rights. Don’t fall for the pressure from the holier than thou crowd that just because you are spiritual and you bought said item from a ‘spiritual’ business, you have no right other than to be grateful and move on. If you feel let down, write and complain – it’s your God-given right to do so!

    Love,
    Lisa

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    • I do agree that her courses were WAY overpriced and am sorry that I made the mistake of saying she said “denounced” when she didn’t, but her words had the same effect.

      I guess, to me, the classes she taught, when she was into things like fairies, tarot, etc. don’t lose their value because the teacher decided to move in a different direction. I’ve always felt that Radleigh was the “tarot guy” on the team, but he teamed up with Doreen because of her name and audience (and, of course, angels).

      Sorry that you feel that you were robbed by HH and DV. 🙁 I totally understand your viewpoint and where you are coming from.

      Love,
      Sue

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  3. Oh, I totally used the word ‘denounced’ myself after watching her Maui TV interview video – that is what she did. I just wouldn’t quote her as saying ‘I denounce…’ The classes she taught, as well as the books she put out there, were all of quite low quality compared to what I have seen on offer by others who charge a lot less to teach… More fool me for going back to her and HH for more… I feel a bit like I was under some kind of spell. Waking up is good. Love, Lisa

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    • I agree about the cost, Lisa! I was SHOCKED to see what the $$ was for the AI course – so I did a lot of the work on my own and with various different resources (yours included) and teachers.

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  4. To be clear Sue was referencing the original April video in which she apparently did directly denounce some of her previous work. The interview video and current explanatory video on Doreen’s Youtube channel are “gentler”.

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    • 😀 Yep! Thank you!

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  5. Is Doreen Virtue truly connected, because if you have had a truly spiritual experience such as a loved one materialising in front of you or a loved one talking to you very clearly from the spirit world, then this experience would blow you away and live with you for the rest of your life. She cannot have had such an experience because if she had then this would have uplifted her for the rest of her life.
    How hypocritical then to denounce mediumship. If god gave man the ability to connect the two worlds and bring such joy, then how on earth can that be wrong. I think she casts a large shadow over spiritual practise and people need to question(because it’s imperatively healthy to do so) what she was all about in the first place.

    Has she had a nervous breakdown, has self guilt finally caught up with her, has she run before she was outed etc etc. Who knows.

    She has mislead a lot of people and I think she needs to be a lot more accountable.

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    • “How hypocritical then to denounce mediumship. If god gave man the ability to connect the two worlds and bring such joy, then how on earth can that be wrong.”

      I love this! Especially connecting the two world to bring joy.

      We have to just allow her to be in her place and us in ours. I also think she has to be accountable and really think about what she says before she says it. Otherwise, her path is hers.

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  6. It saddens me how this all went down. First of all I loved Doreen for her positive spiritual messages with the Angels. I learned a lot from her and pretty much looked up to her. And now I feel like WTF. I don’t mean that in a bad way, but I’m a bit disappointed in how it all went down. Perhaps she should’ve kept that information personal or to herself, instead of somewhat misleading so many people. I know it wasn’t her intent to do so, and I respect each person’s path, but in the end it hurt a lot of us in some ways. I also agree with a previous post where I sensed there was a lot of darkness surfacing and getting in the way of some of our paths, so be wary dear one as I am sure we will all be tested in some way, shape or form. I still believe in Angels, and Angel Readings as I do them and I help many people with my messages. It just hurts to loose someone u love along the way. And unfortunately religion has a way of separating people and being negative and judgemental a lot of times. Not into that.

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    • Hi Karina,

      I totally understand what you mean about religion being a dividing force in many instances, and that was part of what saddened me about the negativity toward the Ascended Masters and deities from other religions. Also, what you said about her hurting a lot of people – perhaps unintentionally, but still.

      We all face darkness and negativity – we can only strive to learn from it and transform it.

      Kind regards,
      Sue

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  7. well said Sue, couldnt agree more x

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    • Thanks, Jackie!

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  8. I am not a member of the tarot community and don’t believe in worshipping anything. But I do have several of her decks and followed her on Facebook. I saw her speak at an Expo 20 years ago. I enjoyed her Facebook posts and pulling a card now and then from the decks for a positive perspective…to get insight or wisdom about something happening in my life. We need positive, especially in these times when their is so much anger and darkness. I have felt startled and confused by what she has done. When I saw her post on Facebook to repent and follow Jesus…it was the language of judgment, narrowness, and cruelty that has been used by so many to justify hate and oppressing others. At a time when there is so much darkness, I feel like another light has gone out in the world. We need lights that point to kindness, hope and bringing love to the world. We don’t need judgmental orders to repent and follow a narrow religion guided by a book compiled from rumors and myths about a time when slavery and ownership of women was the norm. Doreen choosing this path is just as baffling to me as America electing this president. Where has the light gone?

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    • The light is still there, but it has shifted. We have to make sure that it doesn’t go out.

      Blessings,
      Sue

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  9. I bought her books and resonated with her angel work which started years back. Although it was a bit of a shock to hear about such a drastic conversion to a more fundamentalist belief system that clashes with the spiritual community, I was actually turned off to her using her conversion as a public platform to denounce others. When you start preaching to your former audience that they are now evil, surrounding themselves with demons disguised as angels, and need to find a church because it’s mandatory – that is NOT about a personal journey anymore. You are dictating the journey for others using fear|control doctrine. By all means, Doreen should follow whatever her heart leads to if it is sincere. Unfortunately, I do doubt the integrity here and feel there is insincerity in this. Yes, I think the money is lilely a big part of it, cornering a new Christian demographic, but I think there are darker ties to the Elite Establishment with this. Her shift almost appears orchestrated to cause deliberate confusion & chaos amongst the spiritual masses not bound to controlled religion. I do question now if Doreen was a fraud and if I ever really knew her. Sorry, for me, there are just some red flags.

    Since she has chosen to remain a public figure with this change of heart, she will receive both criticism and praise. Either way, I feel people are allowed to express how they feel.

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    • “I was actually turned off to her using her conversion as a public platform to denounce others. When you start preaching to your former audience that they are now evil, surrounding themselves with demons disguised as angels, and need to find a church because it’s mandatory – that is NOT about a personal journey anymore. You are dictating the journey for others using fear|control doctrine.”

      Excellent point, Heather. It wasn’t about her as an individual any longer when she denounced others.

      Something to definitely consider.

      Kind regards,
      Sue

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  10. If you’re interested here’s a link to a public post featuring the April video. Apparently someone, I’m sure one of many, downloaded it from YouTube before it was deleted. Not quite as harsh as I thought it would be from other’s comments. So yes, she’s only directly renouncing the Ascended Masters in this one. I actually find her current video a more direct disavowal of psychic practices.

    https://www.facebook.com/lisa.frideborg.eddy

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    • Thank you for sharing, Jean! I was so curious about what she had said in the original.

      Kind regards,
      Sue

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  11. Praise the Lord. I am so happy that Doreen has found Jesus.
    17 years ago I had an angel experience which led me to one of Doreen’s books at the library. The book, coupled with my Christian faith, helped me to understand what had happened to me. I admire her and wish her all the success in her ministry. God works in mysterious ways.

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    • Glad that you have found your path, Claudette!

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  12. I agree with you, her words on the video, which is back on YouTube, were harsh. I went through the born-again phase with a best friend. She and her husband turned away from everything to follow their path. My friend came around, still has faith but is more centered. Doreen’s turn was complete and although it’s her path, it left me personally very stunned. I have my path, I do not rely on others except for some guidance. I wish her the best. She announced yesterday they are leaving Hawaii…so it’s almost like they are going off-grid.

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    • Hi SueEllen,

      Wow! I didn’t realize they were leaving Hawaii, too. I wonder what is going on in the background… Interesting.

      Kind regards,
      Sue

      Reply

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